Flat Taxes
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05.21.2012 ... Another view of "Taxation": Total Income Tax after Credits, 1980-2009, From http://www.taxfoundation.org/


09.28.2011 ... Breaking news: Hong Kong policies that can not possibly be applied to the US...

Y'know why it is unacceptable in the US? Because it might result in unemployment numbers like these...


08.25.2011 ... OMG: Recent Data seems to follow prior trends and distributions!

Excerpt...

Based on the Internal Revenue Service's 2010 database below, here's how much the top Americans make:

Top 1%: $380,354
Top 5%: $159,619
Top 10%: $113,799
Top 25%: $67,280
Top 50%: >$33,048

SUMMARY OF FEDERAL INDIVIDUAL INCOME TAX DATA

Amazing, isn't it? Not to some... To others, impossible to believe or admit.


04.18.2010... A great Tax discussion from The Kudlow Report ...

Air time: Thurs. Apr. 15 2010 | 7:31 PM ET Discussing whether America can maximize its future under the current tax system, with Rep. Bill Pascrell, (D-NJ) and Rep. Paul Ryan, (R-WI).


03.31.2010... Data Update from the budget summary tables published on the White House website ( http://www.whitehouse.gov/omb/budget/fy2011/assets/tables.pdf ), the American people paid 915 billion dollars to the federal government in 2009, will give the federal government 951 billion in 2010, and the "greedy bastards" want more: they're expecting to receive 2.1 trillion dollars in the year 2020 in individual income tax revenue.

Thank you, Orphe P. Divounguy


03.23.2010... A great Flat Tax update from the NTU...


07.09.2008... HUGE thanks to "pissedoffinarkansas" at Current.com for prompting me to a new thought to add here.... Got a better suggestion? Write me!


Who Pays Income Taxes?
See Who Pays What Percentage, even if you don't like the numbers...

[still active on 03.25.2010]

It turns out that if the entire tax burden were divided
uniformly across all taxpayers, with no deductions allowed,
everyone who owed taxes would have a tax rate probably less than 13%

Does that surprise you?
Who doesn't want you to know things like that?

  • Do some math, rather than just believe what you read in the papers or hear on tv and radio....
    • Take the total amount of taxes collected by the IRS
    • Divide by the number of taxpayers in the US
    • Divide by the total income of all taxpayers in the US
    • The result will come in at under 10%, perhaps as low as 7%
    • Now, factor in a floor income level, below which the worker pays NO income taxes at all, say, about 2x the National Poverty Level Income...]
      (Scroll down to ("The 2009 Poverty Guidelines for the 48 Contiguous States and the District of Columbia")
    • That raises the flat tax on a family of four's income above $44,100 to be about 12%

Who "loses"?

We'll need fewer IRS people. They'll fight to keep their jobs instead of having a flat tax.
Some accountant firms and, of course, tax preparers [think: H&R Block, for example...] will oppose the idea.
But, just like farm subsidies' specious arguments, keeping the IRS and H&R Block in business wastes billions of dollars per year of your tax money, which just might go towards lowering that 13% number to 12%, or maybe even 10% !

Wouldn't you rather pay less, and get the same services from government?

I sure would.

Think about it, and if you can, do the math yourself.


Now, here's the really hard part......

Most of the arguments against the flat tax start with views like, "this is a giveaway to the rich... they'll pay less taxes than they do today.... That's unfair to the little guy... the blue collar wage-earner!"

What you need to think about is this:

  • The $30,000 exemption gives everyone a tax-free "take your whole income home" basis to live on.
  • As for "fairness," what could be more fair than to let everyone keep 90 cents of every next dollar they can earn as income?! ... No matter how much they can manage to earn?
  • If you are going to argue that the millionaire can better afford higher taxes, talk to them or "walk a mile in their moccasins"....
  • Perhaps they or their parents grew up during the Great Depression, and every "next dollar" is as important to them as the "next dollar" to the bloke making $15,000 a year!
  • Like you, who am I to judge how important that money is to them, and who am I to decide how much to take away from them, in the name of "fairness"?
  • Finally, if you are so god-wise and god-powerful as to be the right person to make that decision, maybe the guy or gal standing next to you thinks they're just as capable of putting a different number on that tax bill, and handing the tax-due bill to you.
  • Flat is the fairest tax of all, because it doesn't punish people for their success in making more money, as all graduated, or progressive, income taxes do.
  • If all the money that's been taxed away were left to remain in these people's hands or pockets, what do you really think they'll do with that money? Eat it? No! They'll invest it in companies, factories, businesses that hire people! They'll buy things that those factories can produce.
  • Think about it, for a change, rather than parroting what you've heard. Do some math. You'll be surprised.


You probably wouldn't believe John Stossel of ABC News, either, would you?

"Myth No. 5 .... The Rich Don't Pay Their Fair Share of Taxes

We've all heard this one during the presidential campaign. When it comes to income taxes, the Democratic presidential candidates keep telling us, the rich don't pay enough.

That's a widespread belief, but do the politicians even know how much of the income tax burden the rich pay now?

According to presidential candidate Al Sharpton, "The top one percent in this country pays very much less than ten percent, very much less than five percent."

Sharpton said he thinks the wealthy should pay "somewhere around 15 percent."

But that's so silly because -- and I bet most of you don't know this -- the IRS says the richest 1 percent of taxpayers already pay 34 percent of all income taxes. Twice what Sharpton wanted them to pay.

Still you may feel the rich should pay even more. It's a tempting thought, since they have so much.

But let's remember the facts: the top 1 percent of Americans -- those who earn more than about $300,000 a year -- pay 34 percent, more than a third of all income taxes, and the top 5 percent, those making over $125,000, pay more than half. "

I didn't think so........


Sorry for the inexcusable delay, but tonight [04.05.2006] I ran some numbers through my spreadsheet.

Using some old data from the San Jose Mercury News, published 09.21.2003, I finally proved to myself what I had theorized back in about '77: a 7.5% flat tax would bring as much or more revenue to the governments than their "fair" graduated taxes do.

Bullcrap on the graduated taxes.

Here's the numbers:

Mercury News, 09.21.2003 
poorest 20%
second 20%
middle 20%
fourth 20%
next 15%
next 4%
top 1%
total
Average Family Income $11,100.$23,700.$38,300.$61,900.$111,200.$241,700.$1,630,000.$2,117,900.
Californians' state, local tax burden (2002) - % 11.30%10.10%9.2%8.7%8.1%7.6%7.2%
Californians' state, local tax burden (2002) - $ $1,254.30$2,394.00$3,523.60$5,385.30$9,007.20$18,369.20$117,360.00$157,293.60
Ok, weasels, here's where it gets interesting: Class please come to order!
What's the CA Tax Take if everyone had a 7.5% rate with no deductions? See Next Row:
CA tax revenue with flat tax everyone pays:7.5%$1,254.30$1,777.50$2,872.50$4,642.50$8,340.00$18,127.50$122,250.00$159,264.30
Not progressive enough for you, weasels? The top 5% of taxpayers really do pay most of the taxes!
Hey, wait a minute! Isn't $159 more than $157?! We just suggested a flat tax and the government's revenue went up!
Ok, weasels, too harsh on the poor guy? Let's exempt the bottom 20% of all taxpayers: their income tax = 0% :
CA tax revenue with flat tax zero tax for bottom quintile:7.5%
$0.00
$1,777.50$2,872.50$4,642.50$8,340.00$18,127.50$122,250.00$158,010.00
Omigosh, weasels, we let the bottom 20% off scott-free and the revenue is still higher than it was before!
Let's exempt the bottom 40% of all taxpayers:
CA tax revenue with flat tax zero tax for two bottom quintiles:7.5%
$0.00
$0.00
$2,872.50$4,642.50$8,340.00$18,127.50$122,250.00$156,232.50
Finally, weasels, let's demonstrate how mathematically challenged the lawyers in our state and federal governmens reall are:
One of those bozos got the idea that a flat tax was a good idea, and that all it had to be was just 13%.
[maybe with a few deductions... (wink-wink, nod-nod: government as usual):
CA tax revenue with flat tax zero tax for two bottom quintiles:13%
$0.00
$0.00
$4,979.00$8,047.00$14,456.00$31,421.00$211,900.00$270,803.00
Whoa, Nellie! Hey, can you say "72% higher taxes" with this government math whiz's arithmetic? Sucker!:
Do the math!
Can you get that a flat 13% tax on the top 1% of taxpayers alone would supply the government nearly 35% more in net revenue?!
(Though, of course, the next year, that 1% would all quit working.)
Have you ever read Atlas Shrugged?
I didn't think so....


A quick note on "trickle-down" versus "trickle-up" economics....

Next time you hear someone say "trickle down" is no good, picture the person who's making enough money to hire someone to clean their house or mow their lawn.

Raise that family's taxes, and they just might cut back on some of their expenditures, like the cleaning person or the lawn care folks.

That tax increase just put the housecleaner and the lawn care guy out of work. Maybe they won't be able to buy as much bread or milk for their kids, or gas for their car.

Think about that, too, when someone talks "trickle-down is bad economics."


Here's another story to emphasize the point:

"Let's put tax cuts in terms everyone can understand.

Suppose that every day, ten men go out for dinner.

The bill for all ten comes to $100. If they paid their bill the way we pay our taxes, it would go something like this...

The first four men -- the poorest -- would pay nothing; the fifth would pay $1, the sixth would pay $3, the seventh $7, the eighth $12, the ninth $18, and the tenth man -- the richest -- would pay $59.

....

The ten men ate dinner in the restaurant every day and seemed quite happy with the arrangement -- until one day, the owner threw them a curve (in tax language, a tax cut).

"Since you are all such good customers," he said, "I'm going to reduce the cost of your daily meal by $20." So now dinner for the ten only cost $80.00.

The group still wanted to pay their bill the way we pay our taxes. So the first four men were unaffected. They would still eat for free. But what about the other six -- the paying customers?

How could they divvy up the $20 windfall so that everyone would get his "fair share?"

The six men realized that $20 divided by six is $3.33. But if they subtracted that from everybody's share, Then the fifth man and the sixth man would end up being PAID to eat their meal. So the restaurant owner suggested that it would be fair to reduce each man's bill by roughly the same % amount that they normally paid, and he proceeded to work out the amounts each should pay.

So, the fifth man paid nothing, the sixth pitched in $2, the seventh paid $5, the eighth paid $9, the ninth paid $12, leaving the tenth man with a bill of $52 instead of his earlier $59.

Each of the six was better off than before. And the first four continued to eat for free.

Once outside the restaurant, the men began to compare their savings.

"I only got a dollar out of the $20," declared the sixth man, but he pointing to the tenth, "But he got $7!".

"Yeah, that's right," exclaimed the fifth man, "I only saved a dollar, too.... It's unfair that he got seven times more than me!".

That's true!" shouted the seventh man, why should he get $7 back when I got only $2?"

The wealthy get all the breaks!".

The first four men that had paid nothing yelled all at once, "Wait a minute! We didn't get anything at all! The system exploits the poor!"

The nine men surrounded the tenth and beat him up.

The next night the tenth man didn't show up for dinner, so the nine sat down and ate without him. But when it came time to pay the bill, they discovered (a little late) what was very important. They were FIFTY-TWO DOLLARS short of meeting the bill!

Imagine that!

And that, boys and girls, journalists and college instructors, is how the tax system works.

The people who pay the highest taxes get the most benefit from a tax reduction. Tax them too much, attack them for being wealthy, and they just may not show up at the table anymore. Where would that leave the rest?

Unfortunately, most taxing authorities anywhere cannot seem to grasp this rather straightforward logic! "

T. Davies Professor of Accounting &Chair,
Division of Accounting and Business Law
The University of South Dakota School of Business
414 E. Clark Street
Vermillion, SD 57069

Also attributed in an email to...
David R. Kamerschen, Ph.D.
Professor of Economics, University of Georgia

For those who understand, no explanation is needed.
For those who do not understand, no explanation is possible.


From Reason Magazine, 7.04 issue:

Income and Tax Shares by Income Quintile
Quintile
Income Share
Federal Income Tax Share
Total Federal, State, Local Tax Share
Lowest 20%
3.4%
-1.5%
2.2%
Second 20%
7.0%
-0.5%
5.5%
Middle 20%
11.7%
4.5%
10.5%
Fourth 20%
19.2%
13.6%
19%
Top 20%
58.7%
83.9%
62.6%

Still not "Progressive Enough" for you? What would be????


"Let's look at the following distribution of taxes paid by various wage earners in the US, as reported by the IRS, for the tax year 2000 (the latest year for which the figures are available):

The top 1% paid 37.4% of all federal income taxes;

The top 5% paid 56.7%.....

The top 10% paid 67.3%.....

The top 25% paid 84.0%.....

The top 50% paid 96.1%.....

That means that 50% of the country paid less than 4% of all incomes taxes. The proportion of taxes paid by the top half increases with each year, and will continue to do so. As Gartman points out, we will soon be in the situation where 50% of the voters pay no income tax, yet can vote for higher taxes to be paid by the top half."

Can you spell "Taxation Without Representation"?


From the San Jose Mercury News, an article by Jonathan Weisman, Washington Post:

"The [Congressional Budget Office] study, due to be released today, found that the wealthiest 20 percent, whose incomes averaged $182,700 in 2001, saw their share of federal taxes drop from 64.4 percent of total tax payments in 2001 to 63.5 percent this year. The top 1 percent, earning $1.1 million, saw their share fall to 20.1 percent of this total, from 22.2 percent.

Over the same period, taxpayers with incomes around %51,500 to $75,600 saw their share of federal tax payments increase. Households earning around $75,600 saw their tax burden jump the most, from 18.7 percent of all taxes to 19.5 percent.

The conclusions are stark. The effective federal tax rate of the top 1 percent of taxpayers has fallen from 33.4 percent to 26.7 percent, a 20 percent drop. In contrast, the middle 20 percent of taxpayers -- whose income averaged $51,500 in 2001 -- saw their tax rates drop 9.3 percent.

... Once Social Security, Medicare and other federal levies are excluded, the rich are actually paying a higher of income taxes this year than they would have paid with no tax changes, the CBO also found.

If none of the tax cuts had passed, the top 20 percent would be paying 78.4 percent of income taxes this year. Instead, they will be paying 82.1 percent. In contrast, the middle class share of income taxes dropped to 5.4 percent, from 6.4 percent if no tax cuts had passed.


So, you want it both ways? You want the people with highest incomes to pay most of the taxes, and if there's a tax cut, more of the benefits should go to the people who didn't pay the taxes?

I don't want you to be my "benevolent dictator," thanks.


From an 09.21.04 letter from The Oxford Club....

  • For example, according to the non-profit Tax Foundation, based in Washington D.C., 44% of the U.S. population is completely outside the federal income tax system.
  • So who does pay federal income taxes? The top 20% of income earners pay 80%, and the top 50% pay 96.5%.
    Congratulations! If you're paying income taxes, you're in the richest half of the country.
  • We have a deficit problem, of course, not because Americans aren't being taxed thoroughly enough, but because government spends too much.
  • Last year when I wrote that our "elected misrepresentatives" in Washington spend our tax receipts like sailors with four hours of shore leave, one member fired back an e-mail saying my remark was "an insult to drunken sailors everywhere."
Copyright - 2004 The Oxford Club All Rights Reserved The Oxford Club | 105 West Monument Street | Baltimore, MD 21201


Keep these numbers in mind next time someone tells you that the tax refunds go disproportionately to the rich!
Remind them that the tax payments mostly came disproportionately from the rich!


***Quote of the Day: from taipangroup.com] ]

"Of course, the bulk of Bush's 2003 tax cuts on dividends and capital gains will help people with the highest incomes, but they pay the most taxes in the first place. The tax cuts will also help the entire 100-million-strong investor class - about 50 percent of U.S. households. But when the new IRS income statistics for 2004 and 2005 are published, we will undoubtedly find that lower tax rates - particularly on investment - have again generated much higher tax collections for the so-called richest among us. Already, for the twelve months ending April 2005, non-withheld tax receipts (read capital gains and dividends) rose an astronomical 36 percent."
--Larry Kudlow, June 7, 2005

Gee, lower taxes create more tax receipts.... Why didn't Kerry think that would work? Oh, yeah, blind fixation on a misguided belief .... that's why...


04.15-16.2008... from David R and Larry R. (a different R)

Part 1... Remember the election in 2006? Thought you might like to read the following:

A little over one year ago:

  1. Consumer confidence stood at a 2 1/2 year high
  2. Regular gasoline sold for $2.19 a gallon
  3. The unemployment rate was 4.5%

Since voting in a Democratic Congress in 2006 we have seen:

  1. Consumer confidence plummet
  2. The cost of regular gasoline soar to over $3.50 a gallon
  3. Unemployment is up to 5% (a 10% increase)
  4. American households have seen $2.3 trillion in equity value evaporate (stock and mutual fund losses)
  5. Americans have seen their home equity drop by $1.2 trillion dollars
  6. 1% of American homes are in foreclosure

America voted for change in 2006, and we got it!

Remember it's Congress that makes law not the President. He has to work with what's handed to him.

Quote of the Day........"My friends, we live in the greatest nation in the history of the world. I hope you'll join with me as we try to change it."
--Barack Obama [... change what part of that, again? ..... +af

Part 2: Taxes...Whether Democrat or a Republican you will find these statistics enlightening and amazing.

 
Taxes under Clinton 1999
Taxes under Bush 2008
Single making 30K
tax $8,400
tax $4,500
Single making 50K
tax $14,000
tax $12,500
Single making 75K
tax $23,250
tax $18,750
 
Married making 60K
tax $16,800
tax $14,500
Married making 75K
tax $21,000
tax $18,750
Married making 125K
tax $38,750
tax $31,250

If you want to know just how effective the mainstream media is, it is amazing how many people that fall into the categories above think Bush is screwing them and Bill Clinton was the greatest President ever. If any democrat is elected, ALL of them say they will repeal the Bush tax cuts and a good portion of the people that fall into the categories above can't wait for it to happen. This is like the movie The Sting with Paul Newman; you scam somebody out of some money and they don't even know what happened.

Your Social Security

Just in case some of you young whippersnappers (& some older ones) didn't know this. It's easy to check out, if you don't believe it. Be sure and show it to your kids. They need a little history lesson on what's what and it doesn't matter whether you are Democrat of Republican. Facts are Facts!!! Franklin Roosevelt, a Democrat, introduced the Social Security (FICA) Program. He promised:

1.) That participation in the Program would be Completely voluntary,

2.) That the participants would only have to pay 1% of the first $1,400 of their annual Incomes into the Program,

3.) That the money the participants elected to put into the Program would be deductible from their income for tax purposes each year,

4.) That the money the participants put into the independent "Trust Fund" rather than into the general operating fund, and therefore, would only be used to fund the Social Security Retirement Program, and no other Government program, and,

5.) That the annuity payments to the retirees would never be taxed as income.

Since many of us have paid into FICA for years and are now receiving a Social Security check every month -- and then finding that we are getting taxed on 85% of the money we paid to the Federal government to "put away" -- you may be interested in the following:

-------------------------------------------------------------

Q: Which Political Party took Social Security from the independent "Trust Fund" and put it into the general fund so that Congress could spend it?

A: It was Lyndon Johnson and the democratically controlled House and Senate.

--------------------------------------------------------------------

Q: Which Political Party eliminated the income tax deduction for Social Security (FICA) withholding?

A: The Democratic Party.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Q: Which Political Party started taxing Social Security annuities?

A: The Democratic Party, with Al Gore casting the "tie-breaking" deciding vote as President of the Senate, while he was Vice President of the U S.

-------------------------------------------------------------------

Q: Which Political Party decided to start giving annuity payments to immigrants?

AND MY FAVORITE:

A: That's right! Jimmy Carter and the Democratic Party. Immigrants moved into this country, and at age 65, began to receive Social Security payments! The Democratic Party gave these payments to them, even though they never paid a dime into it!

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Then, after violating the original contract (FICA), the Democrats turn around and tell you that the Republicans want to take your Social Security away!

And the worst part about it is uninformed citizens believe it!

If enough people receive this, maybe a seed of awareness will be planted and maybe changes will evolve. Maybe not; some Democrats are awfully sure of what isn't so.
But it's worth a try. How many people can YOU send this to?

Actions speak louder than bumper stickers.

A government big enough to give you everything you want, is strong enough to take everything you have. - Thomas Jefferson